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    TWM  says:
    I think the bottom line here is that each individual havs their own set circumstances and they have to decide how to handle things.   Y...

    Jason  says:
    I'm certainly not offended and wouldn't be even if that was the point of you reply. Your point is well made and a valid one indeed.  My r...

    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    thank you sharmi, Most of us over 50 years old have chronic pain and some of us get debilitated by it. medications only go so far, the rest is up to ...

    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    hi Jason, I sure appreciate the clarity of your position. People often feel great relief from ambivalence and tension once they are clear, so I am ha...

    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    I was at an event this morning in my community when I spilled an entire cup of ice tea on my lap. Not really my lap, my crotch! Of course I was embarr...

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    Daniel Gottlieb, Ph.D., a practicing psychologist and family therapist, will be live in this section every Wednesday from 4-5 p.m. ET. Leave a question or comment anytime for him!  
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    15 Posts
    Solitude and Loneliness
    By Moongink   
    I am one who has always enjoyed a certain amount of solitude but since my accicent last summer I am alone a lot of time when I wish I wasn't - I am sometimes actually lonely. Everybody thinks "Wouldn't it be cool not to have to work?" My answer is "NO!" I'd
    do just about anything to go back to where I was before my accident. I was a fifteen year (plus) pain management patient (Fibromyalgia, Chronic Myofascial Pain, Osteo-Arthritis, Thoracic Outlet Syndrome, etc.) and I had other health concerns like stereogenosis, hypothyroidism, asthma, etc before my car hit a very large tree last year and broke my neck. I've always been the kind of person that a friend could call at 3AM in an emergency and I would go. Why have so many of the people in my life gone away? Is the whole world really TOO BUSY?
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    Visit Tency's profile
    46 Posts
    Tency  says:
    Dear Moongink,
    I hear you.  I think it is just something with the franticly paced lifestyle for so many in today's society in order to survive these days.  I think everyone has seen a change in their social lives with the economic crisis.  Young people complain that they can not afford to go out on romantic dates like their parents did.  Some people's only outing is to do the groceries these days.
    Additionally the economic crisis has hit many people's social lives drastically cutting down on even informal get togethers.  I have heard people comment, " I would go see so and so, but it is an hour drive, and right now I can barely afford the gasoline to get to work."
    After, my disability made it impossible to work, I noticed my social life greatly reduced.  I find that people are relying more and more on Skype video-visits, and online communication just to visit with family and friends.  I know many people who have get togethers online now, and also make new "virtual" friends.
    The huge challenge for the disabled community is that we are spread out all over the place,
    often looking for places that are affordable and accessible as being the main priority for those of us still on our own.  By the time you meet someone you actually get along with, they may live in a totally different country and chances of a physical get together may be quite daunting.
    I think if you live in a large community you have to belong to some library's book club, or other community run hobby oriented group just to keep socially active.  In smaller town's the cost of living is a bit more affordable and people seem to have country fairs and festivals to look forward to.  At any rate, believe me you are not alone.  There are many of us in the same boat.  Hugs and Wishes, 10C


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    Moongink  says:
    Thanks Tency, This is part of why I joined the site. Hopefully make a few friends who can chat on line. Most of my friends are my age (52) and older and they don't take well to video chats. I have a girlfriend in Australia who chats with me on video but she's on the opposite end of the clock from me which makes it hard enough but she lost a family member recently so I' ve told her not to worry about me for a while..take care of herself. My husband is a great comfort but he has to have a life of his own too so he can't always be here when I start down the road to the dark side. I have been clinically depressed most of my life, you'd think I'd be used to it by now but it's something I don't think anyone gets used to.
    You are right though "frantically paced lifestyle" nails it on the head. When my car hit the tree last summer I dropped out of that rat race.
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    brenda  says:
    I am in the same boat.. I have been looking for a golf cart of sort so I can get outside instead of being cooped up in a small trailer every day.. days are SOOO long:(
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    Visit nanaboombala's profile
    89 Posts
    nanaboombala  says:
    Hi Brenda.......I've been disabled due to a horseback riding accident.....for over thirty years now. I live alone, in a house that's on my best friends property. She has over twenty acres.......so when you mentioned getting a golf cart.......I had to write and tell you that a golf cart has changed my life. I use a power chair to get down the ramp from my front door......to the golf cart........and then the whole twenty acres opens up for me ! It's just wonderful how the ability to get out of the house.......enjoy the beauty all around........changes the feelings of isolation and lonliness. I'd encourage you to get one , if at all possible. I promise that if you do......your days won't quite be......SOOOO long ! The very best of luck !
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    Norma Carroll
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    Moongink  says:
    Hello again All, I feel like the lucky one because I can walk out my back door. but my right hand is paralyzed and I can't stay on my feet long. My wish is for an assistance dog called a "Balance Dog" so I can walk without falling over and always have someone there who can call for help if I take another header into the fireplace or flat out in the yard again. I suppose I am just at the point of accepting my "new" life. I am 4 1/2 months past surgery, they tell me after 6 months I can begin to SLOWLY start doing some of the things I used to. Yesterday I did too much so this morning I had to wake my husband to help me get "up" and find my walker. When they said I could go without the cervical collar I never thought I'd put it back on but I have because of pain I didn't think I'd need the walker again but I guess it's a good idea that I keep it around because a cane just isn't enough support sometimes. All of that I think I can handle but being bipolar and clinically depressed most of my life it's the emotional swings I can't handle everyday, I just wish for someone to chat with when I start to slide in the afternoon. I haven't explored this website enough yet to see if there's a chat room, anyone know? I'm good for today because my husband will be here all afternoon but he has to work on Easter. 
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    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    Moongink said:
    Hello again All, I feel like the lucky one because I can walk out my back door. but my right hand is paralyzed and I can't stay on my feet long. My wish is for an assistance dog called a "Balance Dog" so I can walk without falling over and always have someone there who can call for help if I take another header into the fireplace or flat out in the yard again. I suppose I am just at the point of accepting my "new" life. I am 4 1/2 months past surgery, they tell me after 6 months I can begin to SLOWLY start doing some of the things I used to. Yesterday I did too much so this morning I had to wake my husband to help me get "up" and find my walker. When they said I could go without the cervical collar I never thought I'd put it back on but I have because of pain I didn't think I'd need the walker again but I guess it's a good idea that I keep it around because a cane just isn't enough support sometimes. All of that I think I can handle but being bipolar and clinically depressed most of my life it's the emotional swings I can't handle everyday, I just wish for someone to chat with when I start to slide in the afternoon. I haven't explored this website enough yet to see if there's a chat room, anyone know? I'm good for today because my husband will be here all afternoon but he has to work on Easter. 
    Hello Moongink,

    I am so sorry to hear how much you are suffering with loneliness. And as I am sure you know, loneliness can make depression worse and depression usually makes one feel pretty alone and isolated.
    The resilience research proves what we have all known for a long time – relationships are everything. The more we have, the better off we are. The more we lose, the more at risk we are for a whole variety of illnesses, mental and physical.
    Making matters worse, it's very hard to reach out when you are already depressed.

    Okay, enough with the bad news. Here's the good news. You have already reached out to kindred spirits and hopefully you have had a sense of connection. I also hope many of our members would be happy to Skype with you.

    So here are some of my thoughts about what else you can do.
    I don't know your physical limitations, but if there is any way you could engage in 20 to 30 min. of aerobic exercise four or five times a week, it is very good for depression. (In addition to the professional options of medication and psychotherapy).
    Sleep is also important for depression and it's one of the first things to go when you are depressed. I don't like medication for insomnia unless it is severe. If so, there are some good non-habit forming sleep aids out there – including some antidepressants.
    But you could also look up good sleep hygiene techniques online and that might be helpful.

    I just posted in "the view from here" about Mike Wallace and how he coped with his depression. I have my own history of depression and I know that depression is not me, it's something that happens periodically. I hate it, but when it happens, I talk about it publicly and privately and find myself getting a good deal of support.

    Which brings me to that friend issue. I have treated many families in crisis using something called network therapy. Many people say they are isolated, but when I ask them to call everyone in their network and tell them they need help, usually we get between 20 and 50 people to come over to their house. I think the most important thing, and the most difficult, is to say to a friend: "I need help" or " I need you to spend some time with me because I feel isolated and alone."

    The vulnerability invites compassion. Isolation invites silence. It is so very hard to ask people directly for help. And if you are feeling too depressed to do so, perhaps your husband could begin the process.

    Please take care and please keep us posted.
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    Dan

    Daniel Gottlieb PhD
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    Moongink  says:
    Hi  Dan, Nice to meet you. I do have a psychiatrist and I am on Prozac which of all the meds I've tried works best and I was on Geodon for a while a few years ago because they wanted so much to treat my bipolar disorder (runs in the family) even though I don't think I need it. My little manic episodes are the occasional rewards I get for all the time I spend down. Pre- "tree Incident" as I now refer to last summer's accident, I had long since taken myself off of the bipolar med ... I have never been on a high dose.-it makes me feel out of control. Everybody's bipolar is different and I have to say I am more type II, that my manic episodes are mild and manifest as "perkiness", "chattiness" and general good mood - not such bad things. Until I was thirty I had a lot of anger and rage which has all but disappeared since I was first treated with an antidepressant. And I really was happy pre-tree. When I was in hospital (rehab) they packed me down to my shrink because they thought I was manic and he put me back on Geodon...I was only having some serious anxiety attacks - not such an unusual thing when one hits a really big tree, destroys their car, breaks their neck and isa stuck in a wheel chair. I was not manic. The psychiatrists keep wanting to turn up the dose but every time I do increase for a few weeks I begin having the dark places come to visit more often and I just can't handle it so I back off to 60mg a day. I don't know what to tell the doctor next time I go in. Talk therapy would be nice but I have no income so can't afford copays.
    Anyway, I remembered being told about the Reeve Foundation when I was in the rehab hospital and I've done exactly what you suggested. I have made a couple of friends here - one in Spain! and I am reading some self help books about my hyper sensitivity and also a book on Zen living. Just trying to help myself. I've also applied for a service dog for Balance so I can walk more safely as well as for emotional support so I am trying to be pro active. Thanks for chiming in - I am planning a walking program for myself as soon as weather permits and I have supervision. Since I live in a very rural area (no gyms within 20 miles or more) I'd love to get a new machine called the Nu Step for aerobic exercise but it's much too expensive (they had one at the hospital)...I will post back here with any changes good or bad. I am blessed with a top shelf husband but I am estranged from my son and my childhood family but that was all going on pre-tree. For now I'm trying to stick to one day at a time. Thanks again, Moongink/Carolyn-
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    brenda  says:
    hey there Moongink..
    how did you find out on a balance dog.. how does one apply for one???
    Depression is a serious condiotion also- been dealing with that even before my accident, now its worse and effects my whole family. I am on Wellbutrin for it.
    There arnt many thigs I can do at home without being able to walk, I dont like to read, cant go outside, I do laundry when i feel like it and make dinners sometimes.
    For the mosty part its very quiet here and I think alot and I know thats not right and doesnt help matters.
    I really wish there was a suppport group in my area- there isnt. So I rely on this site to help!

    Hang in there Moon, I know there is a light somewhere- we just havnt found it yet!!
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    Moongink  says:
    Brenda you could use a Full Service Assistance Dog! I can just imagine the changes it would make in your life. Just Google "Service Dog" and look for the .org addresses. I found this one for you: http://www.midamericadogsfoundation.org/  One thing I've learned about being disabled is to ask for what I want...most people will give you whatever you need if it's within their power. Anyway, check some places out and then fill out an application and mail it in! That's all I did....I need a Balance Dog but even more important to me is one that can help me emotionally...when the dark thoughts start creeping in. I don't like going down that path but sometimes I can't stop myself. I'll keep you posted. You give me a call when your tooth is feeling better. Moongink
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    brenda  says:
    Thanks so much for the info!!
    I dont have anyone to ask for what I want or need- any other ideas- i am pretty much alone in my situation here!
    I will call you soon hun- you take care now!!
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    Visit Dan Gottlieb's profile
    590 Posts
    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    Moongink said:
    Hi  Dan, Nice to meet you. I do have a psychiatrist and I am on Prozac which of all the meds I've tried works best and I was on Geodon for a while a few years ago because they wanted so much to treat my bipolar disorder (runs in the family) even though I don't think I need it. My little manic episodes are the occasional rewards I get for all the time I spend down. Pre- "tree Incident" as I now refer to last summer's accident, I had long since taken myself off of the bipolar med ... I have never been on a high dose.-it makes me feel out of control. Everybody's bipolar is different and I have to say I am more type II, that my manic episodes are mild and manifest as "perkiness", "chattiness" and general good mood - not such bad things. Until I was thirty I had a lot of anger and rage which has all but disappeared since I was first treated with an antidepressant. And I really was happy pre-tree. When I was in hospital (rehab) they packed me down to my shrink because they thought I was manic and he put me back on Geodon...I was only having some serious anxiety attacks - not such an unusual thing when one hits a really big tree, destroys their car, breaks their neck and isa stuck in a wheel chair. I was not manic. The psychiatrists keep wanting to turn up the dose but every time I do increase for a few weeks I begin having the dark places come to visit more often and I just can't handle it so I back off to 60mg a day. I don't know what to tell the doctor next time I go in. Talk therapy would be nice but I have no income so can't afford copays.
    Anyway, I remembered being told about the Reeve Foundation when I was in the rehab hospital and I've done exactly what you suggested. I have made a couple of friends here - one in Spain! and I am reading some self help books about my hyper sensitivity and also a book on Zen living. Just trying to help myself. I've also applied for a service dog for Balance so I can walk more safely as well as for emotional support so I am trying to be pro active. Thanks for chiming in - I am planning a walking program for myself as soon as weather permits and I have supervision. Since I live in a very rural area (no gyms within 20 miles or more) I'd love to get a new machine called the Nu Step for aerobic exercise but it's much too expensive (they had one at the hospital)...I will post back here with any changes good or bad. I am blessed with a top shelf husband but I am estranged from my son and my childhood family but that was all going on pre-tree. For now I'm trying to stick to one day at a time. Thanks again, Moongink/Carolyn-
    and this is wonderful news. I'm so glad you are taking such an active role in your own welfare. My experience is that people who are truly devoted to making their lives better, tend to be more successful. But if you are looking for books, I must plug some of mine! Especially "learning from the heart" and my two books geared towards my grandson on the autism spectrum: "letters to Sam" and "wisdom of Sam".
    Please keep us posted about how you are doing. And thanks for the good news!
    Posted:   

    Dan

    Daniel Gottlieb PhD
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    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    hi Brenda,

    I am hoping some folks from the foundation are reading this discussion because I am sure their are  resources in Green Bay.I think you are right on target when you say you need a support group. Being with a kindred spirit changes everything.
    But please don't limit yourself to spinal cord injury. I know there are support groups for people living with depression and bipolar disorder.
    So don't get hung up on specifics, you just need to be with fellow humans who are living with adversity and finding ways to live their lives with grace and gratitude
    Posted:   

    Dan

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    Gordon  says:
    I can relate. When I was first injured in 1990, it was almost like I had Ebola. Our "friends" disappeared from view. This was hard on both me and my wife. We had helped many of them through difficult times but when we were the ones in need it was a different story. Now after 18 years of being out roof the chair and using clip on crutches I am in a high intensity rehab unit relearning how to live in a wheelchair, and dealing with a serious health situation that has arrived out of left field. My wife is limited in the amount of time she can spend here. So I am just plain lonely.
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    Becky  says:
    I think you find out who your real friends are during these situations.  To find new friends you need to make yourself get out and meet people who accept your disability.   The gym, church, and volunteering are great ways to find new people to have in your life.
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    Moongink  says:
    You are 100% right about that...I found out a lot of people weren't really my friends they were just people I knew. The cream of the crop were the two girlfriends that came to hospital to see me....even Church let me down. I will get out and find new people They said after the 6 month anniversary of my surgery I can start SLOWLY doing the things I used to.
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    89 Posts
    nanaboombala  says:
    Hey Moongink...........if you have two real friends.........you're rich ! I've had one for over thirty years........we live on the same property..........she and her husband in their house.......I in mine. She has been there always.......the night of my accident thirty years ago......and today ! I learned a long time ago.......fleeting friends can be many......especially if you're disabled ! Some people seem to be scared of anyone not considered " normal ".....they don't know what to say......or do ! It's great that you're asking for help.........I think maybe we all grapple with that one.......that you're finding ways to comfort yourself. Congrats on your upcoming anniversary ! I hope you can resume as much of your old life as is possible........and find new ones if you can't ! Many blessings to you.............Norma
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    Norma Carroll
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    41 Posts
    Terry217  says:
    Hi Moongink,
    I noticed too that my circle of friends got much smaller with time after my injury. (I am now 2 years post injury). But there are many good people on line here...my computer is now my link to the world. I hope to hear more from you and how you're progressing.
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    futtatinni  says:
    I have noticed the exact same thing over here and it seems like the more time that goes by the smaller the number of people in my life becomes.
    Sadly I don't feel this is limited to just friends. Also includes family which really is rotten.

    I can't worry about that though - I've got a full plate already with everything else I have to deal with on a daily basis. 

    I can say this much though about this - I don't necessarily blame the people who faded into memory as I've not really been the most responsive to people either. I know a good deal of this is due to the pain and depression that I've been dealing with since my injury in almost 2 years ago (it was only confirmed to me 6 months ago). 

    I find that online resources have been the most supportive for me. Facebook "friends" that I have never met have done more for my emotional wellbeing than some of my own family. 
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    Visit Dan Gottlieb's profile
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    Dan Gottlieb  says:
    Whenever we experience any trauma, we feel alone in this world – that no one will ever understand us again. And all of this happens immediately and can last for years.
    We all understand that nobody leaves us because they want to hurt us. They leave us because of their anxiety or helplessness or their fear of their own vulnerability. Of course, that doesn't make us feel any better. But stays and why do they stay?

    The people that stayed in my life were the ones who truly loved me and had the courage to face their own anxiety and helplessness. But the people I have in my life since then are people who are loving. People who can see vulnerability and feel kindness and compassion. And yes, many see vulnerability and run for the hills.

    But we don't have to leave this to chance, not completely anyway. We can help people feel more comfortable with our vulnerability just as soon as we feel comfortable with our own. Once we have learned to accept and even appreciate our bodies, we can teach others how to do so also. Not through words necessarily but trust through our presence.

    I've talked before about mirror neurons that resonate to the experience of the people we are with. These mirror neurons don't respond to broken bodies, but they do respond to anger, fear and resentment. They also respond to open vulnerability, kindness and a kind of emotional welcome. I know, I know easy to say and hard to do. First let's open our kind hearts to ourselves and then we can get to work with others.

    And I certainly understand the very real external issues of how difficult it is for us to find access to other humans. I wonder if the folks at Christopher Reeve could possibly set up a video meeting once a month so that we could all chat together. Don't know if that is possible technologically, but worth asking.
    Posted:   

    Dan

    Daniel Gottlieb PhD
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    Moongink  says:
    Thanks for chiming in Futtatinni. I have the same experience with people, friends? and family. Family who weren't speaking to me before my accident and who wouldn't tell me why or what I did wrong. Depression I have lived with for years because my mother was too much of a prude to explain the facts of life to me so I wound up pregnant at 16 years old, making me the family unwed mother/black sheep. They all have money and I've never been the "keeping up with the Jones" type and I settled for one year of tech school in trade for my father providing my son's education. Pre-Tree Incident I was basically happy because we were paying our bills, putting a little away and we have a good marriage - that money can't buy. My sister actually once said "Who knew YOU would be the one to wind up with the healthy realtionship?" I didn't realize what a vicious remark that was until much later. Now I may have to ask her for charity to get buy until I either get better or I win my  SSD appeal. I've always known life was unfair but I've been kicked down so many times I don'tknow if i want to get up. My anonymous Facebook friends are my best support too. I will email you my FB name privately. Take care. Moongink
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    nanaboombala  says:
    Hi Dan.....I wish you'd speak a little more about mirror neurons. Does it mean that....if I'm fearful, angry and resenrful.....people will respond in kind ? ............and if I show vulnerability and knidness.....that's what I'll get back in return ? It can't be that simple.......I mean about mirror neurons. Then again, maybe it is. But I do wish you'd elaborate........or lead me to your posts about it ( if I can find it.......I'm not very good at negotiating this site......I've already posted something that is very public......where I meant it to be......private ! ) Thanks.
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    Norma Carroll
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    Gerthro  says:
    It is very possible to set up a video chat. Let me look into it.

    Rob
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    Rob Gerth
    Director Digital Media
    Christopher & Dana Reeve Foundation
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    Moongink  says:
    Thanks Gerthro! I've never done vidoe chat with more than on person. I can't seem to get on skyoe though, something to do with microphone compatability. I'll work on it.
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    Daniel  says:
    Well all i can say is it's really been hard on me. Everyone left within 6 mos. after i got out of the hospital. My friends,my family,my co-workers which were close friends too. The only one that stuck with me is my now wife who was my fiance when I wrecked out. If she left with the amount of depression I already have, I'm affraid of what i'd do to myself. It is really hard, even after 5 years, for me to accept the fact that everyone I had in my life litterally got up and walked away. The really weird thing was even my online friends quit talking to me. They (meaning all of them) never gave me a reason. They just quit talking to me and never came around again. I guess to me I see it as kicking a guy when he's already on the ground bleeding and to me is unacceptable.
    D~
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    sarah10  says:
    "I've always been the kind of person that a friend could call at 3AM in an emergency and I would go. Why have so many of the people in my life gone away? Is the whole world really TOO BUSY?"

    My experience as wife of 34 years to a quadriplegic is, yes, the circle of friends indeed gets very small.  But the old friends and new friends that stay are the VERY BEST people one could meet in any circumstance.

    Sarah
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